Hakker’s HUSS, Hybrid, and H4GS Stack Routine Reverse Engineered
It seems that even right now, in the year 2014, 2 full years after the infamous GrowTallForum.com discussion board was shut down due to the member’s petty arguments, people are still somehow interested in Thomas’s/Hakker’s routines, specifically his HUSS Stack Routine, the HYBRID Routine, or something known as the H4GS Stack. There were some other methods like the H5GS method but we have almost no information about those methods. I am going to fully describe in as much detail as possible what was the extend of Thomas’s research and how far he managed to push the endeavor. We were first made aware of this guy who called himself that name and wrote about him in one of our earliest posts “Who Was “Hacker” And What Was His Method Or Technique? Almost Everything You Wanted To Know”. Back then we were were just going about copy and pasting his old posts from the forums and didn’t get any chance to look over the science of what he was doing.
I personally did interview Thomas on the 5th episode of the Natural Height Growth Podcast (Click Here to Listen) and he did mention how his stacks eventually worked out. At some point in our discussion, he fully admitted to me (and all that listened to the episode) that while his stacks did work for people with growth plates still available, it would not work on people with closed growth plates, in any of the cases. He also mentioned that I would probably get bored with doing the research, but so far this problem still interests me enough to continue to just read and write.
We did find a list of all the possible compounds that Thomas ever recommended to be in any stack so we guess that one of the combinations and formulations was the HUSS Stack Routine. We noted that in the post “H.U.S.S. Method For Height Increase By Hakker For Stacking Found”
This is my final attempt at trying to summarize every last part of his knowledge into one condensed area. So let’s begin
I was recently looking for more information on this term I remember seeing before called “H4GS” when I found old posts written by Hakker. He had supposedly posted on the BodyBuilding.com website under the names Hakker and iHakker. The threads he wrote for are available Here, Here and Here. People even now have posted on the website (here) looking for more information on his “advanced” methods. There was also supposed to be a website or forum called www.ihakker.com , www.biohakker.com, hakker.betaboard.net, hakker.forumei.net, and www.heightcatalyst.com These are now all dead websites. He’s definitely moved on in his life from this endeavor, which he did give 3-4 years of. There have been some other websites which have been very informative like www.kazlina.com (run by a former moderator of the grow tall forum who called herself Kazlina) and www.heighteffects.com (which was pronounced as Height FX and run by someone also made a real effort in trying to figure it out, also looking into the connection between pregnancy and growth) but all of these website are no longer around either. What I had to do was scrape together everything that I could to give a full summation and outline on his research.
Based on what what he communicated with Tyler, he understood the material at a relatively high level of scientific sophistication. It is time that we take the knowledge that they did, outline it in a way that we can all can digest, and build upon their work and research.
One thing that he did fully agree with was the fact that once your growth plates are fused, you can’t get them back. We quote him saying “It’s impossible to get the growth plates back once they are fused,…”
Here is a few shorthand terms that he would use consistently…
- GT4I – stands for the hugely popular E-Book/Scam product “Grow Taller 4 Idiots”. You can download it in PDF form from many websites.
- LSJL – Lateral Synovial Joint Loading – just do a search on the website to learn more about this.
- Ghen – stands for Ghenerate, which has been a type of pill sold on the internet which is supposed to increase the level of GH in the body.
- IGH1 – stands for IGH-1, which was a type of pill that was sold on the internet
- CPM1 – is Closed Plates Method 1 – This included LSJL
- CPM2 – stands for Closed Plates Method 2 – this method was supposed to possibly regenerate back the growth plates.
- MOD GRF – Modified Growth hormone Releasing Factor – a 29 amino acid peptide analog of Growth-hormone-releasing hormone
- GHRP2 – Growth Hormone Related Peptide Type 2 – stimulates the pituitary gland’s production of human growth hormone (HGH)
(Note: Everything written in italics are quotes which were originally written by Thomas/Hakker)
6 methods, each consisting of a stack of oral supplements/compounds carefully put together to ensure maximum safety and optimal height gain. In order of potency and growth capability:
So first up:
- Method 1 – MENS. This is by far the cheapest and most bang for buck method. For beginners.
- Method 2 – HUSS – Advanced stack – ~2.5cm per month
- Method 3 – HYBRID – ~3.5cm per month / HYBRID-Injectable ~4.5cm per month
- Method 4 – H4GS – Experimental stack – 4cm+ per month
The 1st routine, called M.E.N.S. Routine Stack
Apparently Thomas did NOT create the routine himself, but it was formulated by something named Cliffs.
This consisted of 4 elements
Melatonin – Dosage: 3 mg – the best time to take the melatonin is around 20 minutes before going to sleep. You want to stay out of the man-made lights after taking the melatonin. The intended effect is for the melatonin to ….” get rid of excess estrogen and promotes deep sleep”
Niacin – Dosage: 100 -500 mg – (Niacin goes by many names, including Niacin B3, B-3, Vitamin B3, and Nicotinic Acid). Its chemical formulation is C6H5NO2)
Warning #1: The study that Hakker’s basis his facts on had the original experimenters deliver the niacin intravenously, through needle and syringe at the amount of 500 mg. He recommend that we do it orally. This represents a huge difference, since many vitamins and minerals we take orally will be removed in the stomach and filtered out by the liver and kidneys, before ever reaching the blood stream. Taking any drug intravenously is much more effective.
Warning #2: The niacin dosage was begun at 375 mg/day, and then increased progressively over the course of the study, and maintained at a level of 2,000 mg nightly for 8 weeks. This is more than 4X what Hakker suggested taking orally.
In terms of how to take it, you take the niacin at a fasting state (on an empty stomach), since it is supposed to supplement and increase the GH releasing effects of Ghrelin. Ghrelin is the enzyme that the release by the stomach to tell the brain that the body is hungry and needs to eat and get nutrition. So again, take the niacin about 3 and a half hours after taking a protein shake. Don’t take any more carbs for at least 3 more hours. Proteins are okay to take, even 30 minutes after taking the Niacin, which should cause the flush. Just no carbs for a few huors.
The protocol he suggests is the following…
- Eat meal
- Wait 3 hours
- Take Niacin at 500 mg
- Wait for the flush
- Start your workout
- Take your protein shake after the workout
- Wait 2 and a half more hours afterwards
- Take the dextrose powder and carbs
This series of steps is supposed to increase one’s muscle mass at a high rate.
Over the issue of the flush: Most people who listened to Hakker’s advice believe that you should only be taking the flush type of Niacin. Even if you have bought the right type, the flush type, after taking it for a while, one might no longer feel the effect of the flush. Hakker suggests that when this happens, look for other pill bottles sold which have the niacin labeled as “Nicotinic Acid”. (We personally don’t understand the scientific reason for this claim). The other option to take if one is noticing that the flush is no longer there after a certain amount of time, is to stop taking the niacin for 3 days, drop the dosage by half to just 250 mg for a couple of days, and then go back up to 500 mg.
For the experimenters, they didn’t want their patients to feel the effects of the ‘flush’ so they gave the patients some aspirin, which seems to mitigate the flushing effects of Niacin.
Sleep – Duration: 8 hours – since the melatonin you would take is to help the pineal gland to modulate better the circadian rhythm, you want to set your sleeping schedule and cycle to be as close to the rise and set of the sun, which sets the level of ambient light. (So pretend you are our gorilla/primate ancestors long ago and use that type of sleep schedule where they rise and fall based on the sun).
Exercise – sprinting – do the high intensity resistance & high intensity sprints every 2 days. No more than 10 minutes should be enough. The suggested duration is to sprint about 5 minutes just 3 days out of each week, which would be enough. The other suggested way is to do the 5 minute sprints every other day of the week, which averages out to be 3.5 days.
The Cycling Issue for Niacin/B3 – Hakker/Thomas recommended that you use the Niacin every other day.
As for the longer time frame, for the Niacin, take it every other day for two weeks, then cycle off for 1 week. Another options he wrote was to cycle on the niacin for 4 weeks, and then go off the cycle for 2 weeks.
- He also wrote that even 5 days of cycling off the niacin after 4 weeks of cycling on it would be enough.
(As the readers can see, some of the information and advice he has given has been inconsistent, about the cycling down time frame. We can only guess that his advice changed over the years after he did more research and became more informed and knowledgeable on the cycling effects of long term niacin usage).
Flush type over the Non-Flush Type
- Flush/The correct type – The label states “Vitamin B3 and/or Nicotinic Acid”
- Non-Flush/ The Incorrect type – The label states “Niacinamide, Inositol Hexanicotinate, & other Niacin Timed release supplements”
How He Explained Why Taking Niacin Would Work
As we have already stated before in the description of Niacin, Hakker’s reasoning was that the Niacin would have a type of additive effect to the pituitary-hypothalamic GH stimulatory effect of the Grehlin compound, which also stimulates the brain for GH release. He suggested to take the niacin on an empty stomach. Empty stomachs already have the intestinal-neural stimulatory pathway build in. The protein/enzyme Ghrelin signals to the brain that the body is hungry, which is supposed to trigger GH release, based on Hakker’s logic.
His logic was that with a slight nudge to the GHRH and Niacin, you would be able to get the same level of GH release stimulated as using the combination of MOD GRF and GHRP2. He talked about combining 4 different types of compounds to stimulate GH for a maximum GH burst/release, but some of the other things he mentions we still haven’t figured out.
Then mention of how GH release goes by 3 hour cycles is something we couldn’t figure out. He might be basing it on the fact that usually, the GH is released the most during sleep. Sleep is controlled by the circadian rhythm, which is categorized into stages, and measured by the frequency waves from a type of EEG machine. One cycle in the sleep cycle, accounting all the stages, is about 3 hours long.
Read the excerpt from BodyBuilding.com which he posted below.
The Cycling for the Melatonin: Use the Melatonin for 5 days, and then cycle off for 2 days.
This would have been the cheapest and simplest method to implement. You are trying to increase the level of HGH in the entire body/system. The high doses of Niacin and inhibiting aromatase, which is known as o-estrogen, is done using melatonin.
The 2nd Routine, called the H.U.S.S. HUSS Stack Routine Method
This method is the one that so many people have been trying to get from us for so long. We have gotten dozens of messages asking us what this particular message was. We finally figured it out because of notes left by someone else recently this year. They made a post (Available Here) on the intended effects on what HUSS is supposed to do. The notes that they left helps us reconstruct the stack that Thomas had. It was relatively easy to figure out, once we just used simple logic to reverse the causality process of effects and the pills that would cause them. We also used the list of compounds we had found previous from the post “H.U.S.S. Method For Height Increase By Hakker For Stacking Found”
You are trying to increase the level of growth hormone secretion using whatever peptides and hormones are in your body. You are going to signal to the PI3K pathway to induce the MSCs in the marrow of the bones to differentiate into chondrocytes. If this method was successful, it would have validated the theory that the PI3K pathway was essential in the process of endochondral bone growth.
Two other factors mentioned this stack as intended to do were the following…
- Increase the level of DNA methylation or at least keep it at a high enough level. This was supposed to keep the cartilage from fully ossifying or maybe even regenerating back the cartilage tissue.
- It is supposed to inhibit the level of somatostatin release into the system.
So let’s figure a few parts out for you guys.
The H.U.S.S. stack stands for 4 elements, just like before.
H – This stands for Hexarelin – Dosage: 50 micrograms per day – take in morning – this would activate the PI3K Pathway. It is a type of GHRP-6 Analog. When combined with the compound GHRH-(1-29)-NH2 (Dosage at 1 microgram/kg) then the two compounds work together has a type of synergistic effect.
The problem with this particular compound is that using it would increase the level of prolactin, cortisol, and desensitization of the receptors so you can’t over use this compound. That is why they tell you to use it just once a day.
U – Hyperzine A – Dosage: Unknown – We had to compare the notes of people who had the compounds with other notes made by others to figure out this compound. Note the reason why this stack was called H.U.S.S. – The HU represents the HUperzine A compound. However, that is not enough.
The claim made by the folks is that this compound is a somatostatin inhibitor. The person who posted on the forum just this year stated that for the second stack, the HUSS, one of its intended effects is to inhibit the release of somatostatin into the system. Physiologically it makes a little bit of sense. The GH and the Somatostatin are both released by the hypothalamic-anterior pituitary bi-organ system in a checks-and-balances way. The somatostatin would block the effect of GH. In this way, if you can stop the somatostatin, you give the somatropin (aka GH) sort of free rein to do stuff to the tissue of the system.
S – 3 elements, all for supposedly methylation of the DNA 1. SAM-e, 2. MSM & 3. Chondroitin
SAM-e (S-Adenosyl methionine) (Aka Ademetionine) – Dosage: – Apparently this compound would stimulate DNA Methylation and increases the proliferation of the cells towards the epiphyseal line.
MSM & Chondroitin – The MSM stands for (methylsulfonylmethane) is a source of sulfur, one of the most abundant minerals in the human body. Sulfur is essential in many body functions. It’s critical to the production of healthy collagen. This one is the only one which we are not completely confident about. The guess is made because of the emphasize made by Hakker over the fact that multiple elements of a stack was claimed to be used for DNA Methylation. – Dosage: 1000 mg per day
The Explanation on why the S & S stands for SAM-e and MSM & Chondroitin – We had to get this information from PhenomHCL, who was a follower of Xcrunner’s research. It seems that Thomas based his HUSS formulation from Xcrunner’s claims. We found a post made which showed that Xcrunner believed that the growth plates never fully go away. They never fully seal, but only remain inactive. Apparently, if you take SAM-e & MSM & Chondroitin, you can “reactive” the inactive growth plates. For evidence on this rather extreme claim, just check out our clipped picture below.
S – Sleep – 8 Hours, focus on syncing sleep with 8 hours, sun light,
Update Feb 24th, 2014 – We had to rethink this part, since it was something we left out. One of the elements which begins with S should be for sleep. For this, follow the same advice as what is written for the MENS stack routine. 8 hours, focus on sleeping along with natural sun light, and sync one’s circadian rhythm to the cycle of the sun.
As for diet, obviously use good judgement, eat healthy, and focus on real nutrients and vitamins.
The 3rd Routine, (This might either be the HYBRID Method, part of the HUSS method, or some other method that is a derivative of the HUSS stack but separate from it)
This method is similar to something another forum member created or suggested. This is believed to have been created by Xcrunner, who claimed that he was going to be in Medical School back in those years (2006-2010). The idea again is to prevent bone maturation.
- You want to stimulate the PI3K Pathway
- You want to stimulate the system to increase the release of IGF-1.
- The intended effect was that the rate of osteoblast proliferation would be increased.
- The other intended effect from the stack is that it is supposed to keep the feedback loop in the body negative. Apparently, the logic was that if the output of the feedback loop was kept at “negative”, the signal to the hypothalamus-pituitary gland organs would be kept “on” continuing to release more GH (than if the loop would have turned the GH stimulated release off).
It would prevent the accumulation of testosterone in the blood.
There was two supplements Xcrunner mentioned with should possibly let a person continue to increase in height no matter what age a person would be at. We did a few posts on his research in the post “From GrowTallForum.com, Xcrunner211 Notes On Height Increase For Teenage Males With Open Plates, Warning NSFW”
You combine whatever supplements is supposed to be taken with high intensity exercise like basketball to induce microfractures. The natural ability for the bones to cover up over microfracture means that the bones are supposed to grow thicker (and possibly longer) over time.
The 4th Routine – H4GS Stack
One claim made by a recent poster was that this stock is supposed to consistof only 3 main compounds – Letrozole, Oxandrolone, & Ghenerate. We suspect that this stack we have reverse engineered also includes the CJC-1295 & Melatonin.
- H – Hexarelin – Read message above on HUSS stack
- H – Huperzine A – Read message above on the HUSS stack
- H – GHRH-NH2 – this compound is one that Hakker just called the GHRH2 or I-29. It has a very high effect of GH release when combined with Hexarelin
- H – IGH-1 – Why the people of the forum was so adamant on using SAM-e, Ghenerate and IHG-1 in combination makes no sense to us.
- G – GHenerate – Obviously the G stands for Ghenerate
- S – SAM-e – The S represents the SAM-e compound.
Some claims made by Hakker in the beginning
- It should be possible to increase in height by 2 inches in the spine or torso region through a combination of using LSJL + GT4I + Ghen + IGH1
- Another stack idea proposed which is MENS + Ghenerate + IGH1. Include also the GT4I as well since he states that it will help greatly
- He claims that he grew 5 cms in 2 months from doing his own methods. This would have increased his original height of 5 3″ to around 5′ 5″. Based on the ages that we were given, he was probably about 15-16 during that time range.
- Apparently Hakker never tried to do the MENS stack, but other types. He did the HUSS Method, Hybrid, H4GS, and some future method called the H5GS.
- If you do the MENS routine correctly, you should be able to increase in height about 1.5 cms per month on average.
- It is possible to gain 4 inches of height through the spine/torso part only.
Some conclusive thoughts
At some point, people started to accuse that this Hakker guy was a 15 year old young kid who was just 5′ 3″ and wanted to play as super-scientists in one of the various threads that I read. Based on what I did learn after interviewing Thomas, his age at least seems to have been validated.
Some other information about the effects of Niacin, at least hypothesized by Thomas. (source) Almost all of the information about niacin was based on just one main study. (source:“Growth hormone, cortisol and glucagon concentration during plasma free fatty acid depression. Different effects of nicotinic acid and an adenosine derivative“)
“one frequently overlooked “side effect” is that niacin is a powerful releaser of growth hormone (Quabbe, et al, 1983) (Fig. 3). Quabbe and colleagues administered 500 mg niacin intravenously to humans, and noted a dramatic rise in growth hormone.”
During the 2nd half of this study, the experimenters put some fatty acids into the body. The fatty acids blocked the GH release. This is why Hakker has always claimed that one should not eat carbs, since the back building block of carbs, sugars, turns into acids. However, based on that logic, we should say to avoid any fatty foods, since the basic building block of adipose tissues or fats, is fatty acids. Some author also stated that glucose and insulin also inhibits the release of GH, so the basic idea is just don’t eat to let the GH do its work.
The Side Effects
Some sources say that there is no harmful side effects even with high levels of Niacin, but we don’t believe that. If you are taking the flush type, the most obvious side effect is that you will feel this rush of heat through the body like a wave of heat running down the body, similar to the heat in a tanning salon.
The most likely side effect has been some type of damage to the liver. There will most likely be elevation of liver enzymes or liver toxicity.
“Niacin aggravates blood sugar problems in insulin dependent diabetics, further worsening their lipid problems, usually causing their triglycerides to skyrocket. Alternatively, I recommend niacinamide (also contained in Optimum D) in doses up to three grams daily for insulin dependent diabetics.”
What is good about getting the Vitamin B3 intravenously is that it does seem to be doing a better job at increasing the HDL (High Density Lipoprotein) aka Good Cholesterol while also lowering the LDL (Low-Density Lipoprotein) aka Bad Cholesterol (at a lower degree). (Read about the difference between the two types Here from the American Heart Association). The researchers believe that while the HDL helps prevent heart attack, the LDL causes plaque build up in the arteries. In addition, the triglyceride levels were also lowered.
I think we should just admit that the Niacin acts similar to Nitric Oxide. It is a type of vasodilator. It relaxes the vascular smooth muscles and allows more blood flow in the capillaries. This is known as the flush.
In the end, we are only reporting the information currently. It will take us much longer to do the necessary research to see whether these proposed ideas have any validity.
Remember again this though. Thomas/Hakker himself stated to me in the 5th Podcast Episode that none of his stack worked for people who had closed growth plates in the end. That is something to take away from all this and think about. We can not promise anything real either, only that we are going to stick with the research and never stop learning.