As a followup to the previous post, I wanted to figure out which ethnic group is the tallest in the world. Again, we go back to the initial resource link we had used before on wiseGEEK found HERE

Of course to be able to answer that question, we have to define what is exactly an “ethnic group” and what is the difference between the words and terms ethnic group and ethnicity and race and nationality.

Let’s explain all the terms from easiest to hardest.

1. Nationality – Nationality refers to the geo-political land mass you are associated with by political and military treaties derived terms from rules and regulations. Where you hold your citizenship is what your nationality is. Usually, the country of your passport is the country of your nationality (although not always, exceptions can be expats, asylum seekers, spies ie. 007 James Bond). If you have dual citizenship, like being both Canadian and American, you have dual nationality.

This means that if you are chinese and you were born by chinese parents in China but you moved to the USA and became an american citizenship through naturalization, your nationality is American or USA.

Note: By coincidence (or maybe not so much coincidence) we had answered in our previous post HERE the question “What is the tallest nationality?”

2. Race – Race as defined by Wikipedia found HERE is “”a classification system used to categorize humans into large and distinct populations or groups by heritable phenotypic characteristics, geographic ancestry, physical appearance, ethnicity, and social status. In the early twentieth century the term was often used, in a taxonomic sense, to denote genetically differentiated human populations defined by phenotype.””

Apparently, the word “race” was originally used to refer to any nations or ethnic groups. From Wikipedia, “”In the 18th century, the differences among human groups became a focus of scientific investigation…The 1775 treatise “The Natural Varieties of Mankind,” by Johann Friedrich Blumenbach proposed five major divisions: the Caucasoid race, Mongoloid race,Ethiopian race (later termed the Negroid race), American Indian race, and Malayan race, but he did not propose any hierarchy among the races. Blumenbach also noted the graded transition in appearances from one group to adjacent groups and suggested that “one variety of mankind does so sensibly pass into the other, that you cannot mark out the limits between them”.

In addition, “”In the last two decades of the 18th century polygenism, the belief that different races had evolved separately in each continent and shared no common ancestor, was advocated in England by historian Edward Long and anatomist Charles White.””

It is without a doubt that because of the idea and creation of race, a lot of struggles and pain an suffering has resulted. Social scientists, anthropologist, and geneticist have all tried to define the term “race” as accurately as possible while most geneticists have pretty much concluded that the idea of race is very hard to find from a biology point of view at least right now. Since the science does not back up the idea of “race”, I have decided to not talk about race since it is a poorly understood or even defined word/ concept. I personally do not believe in the idea of “race” since the concept is too fuzzy and inaccurate that the very definition of the word can be left to interpretation toevery subjective person’s own biases. For me, what can not be easily defined will not be discussed too much.

3. Ethnicity  – That leaves up to only figure out what is the difference between the terms “ethnicity” and “ethnic group” . From this PDF found off the University of Deleware website HERE. the word ethnicity is defined as “”identification with and feeling a part of, an ethnic group and exclusion from certain other groups because of this affiliation. ”

That means that the term “ethnicity does not directly describes physical attributes and characteristics like height. It really is a “feeling”. When the word “identification” is used, that means that it really is talking about a belief system, not a system that implies or directly is related to physical characteristics perse. Thus, the word “ethnicity” does not really imply height generalizations or stereotypes.

For example, if you asked people in both North and South Korea what their ethnicity is, they would say that they are both Korean. However, the average height of the North Koreans is far lower than the average height of the people in South Korea.

In general, the relative group size of the terms “nationality” and “ethnicity” are usually the same. Not so for the term “asian”.

Asia is a continent of 4 billion people. Ethnicity and Nationality refers most often to one’s country of origin or the nation one’s relatives came from. Since the USA is a nation of immigrants, the USA is a big exception to the rule that the group size of “ethnicity” should be the same as for “nationality”. For most people in the world, when you ask them what is their ethnicity or nationality, they give the same answer, like Lithuanian, Polish, Thai, etc. BUt for the US, you ask them their nationality, they will say “American” but when asked about their ethnicity, they might say something like “1/2 english, 1/4th german, 1/8th french, 1/8th Cherokee”

4. Ethnic Group – An Ethnic group is defined as “”shared beliefs, values, habits, customs and norms, and a common language, religion, history, geography, kinship or “race”. The PDF make the important point that ethnic groups are “view and treated as if features are biological”. So now we see that the term “ethnic group” is far better and more accurate at describing and defining a group of people. The size of the group is also the smallest.

An example is that even though most people think that the country of India is mostly homogeneous, it is actually a conglomerate of smaller ethnic groups that combine together to give themselves one label, one word that defines them. There are at least over 40 small ethnic groups that make up the country of India. In general, the term “ethnic group” kind of gives the impression of a tribe, more than a city-state.

So this is why I am trying to use the term “ethnic group” when I ask what is the question “What is the tallest ethnic group in the world?”

Let’s FINALLY get to answering that question now.

I remember going through the over 300 comments below the question and a specific area appeared over and over again where people stated that the height of people was very large.

It was a area that included, croatia, serbia, bosnia/herzegovina, and montenegro. One area that was stated in almost mythical ways was Dalmatia. Personally, I had never even known such a place existed, except the reference to the dog breed type Dalmatians.  Apparently the whole region can combined and referred to as the dinaric alps area.

From this scientific study HERE done in 2005 of the measurement of men from the dinaric alps area, 28% of all males was over 1.90 meters in height. That is insane. If we now consider the fact that the data taken also included say older generations which are probably shorter, we could state that 1 out of every two males in the area is 6′ 3″ or taller. I have heard many stories and references about the height of men from Croatia and Serbia.

Let’s take a look at the circumstantial evidence and try to build a case for our selves.

1. I have met maybe 3 people who I was sure was Croatian. One guy I talked to who was 6′ 1′ told me that he was the shortest guy in his family of 4 brothers. The others, I never asked about their height.

2. 2008 100 meter butterfly in swimming silver medalist Michael Cavic is 6’6″.

3. Retired basketball legend and Bulls Toni Kukoc was 6′ 11″.

4. The tallest tennis player is Ivo Karlovic who stands at 6′ 10″ from Croatia. and Marin Cilic is 6’6″

5. World Cup’s tallest striker – Serbia’s 6ft 7.5 ins forward Nikola Zigic

6. Vanja Iveša – 2.05m – (6ft 8½”) – Croatian goalkeeper playing with Turkcell Super Lig club Eskişehirspor

7. Lazar Jovisić – 2.02m (6ft 7½”) –  21 year old Serbian goalkeeper transferred to CD Nacional in Portugal in 2008.

8. Vanja Ivesa – 2.05 m (6′ 9″) – Croatian goalkeeper

9. Darko Milicic – drafted 2nd in 2003 by NBA after Lebron James – 6’11-7’0″

10. Miladin Kovacevic – accused of assaulting student and tried to flee country – 6′ 10″

11. Vlade Divac – 7′ 1″ – famous NBA former player –

17. Serbia basketball players over 7 feet tall: 1. Nenad Krstic – 7′ 0″, Stephan Lukovic – 7′ 0″, Nemanja Arsic – 7′ 0″, Bogdan Radosaljevic – 7′ 0″, Dejan Musli – 7′ 0″, Nikola Milutinov, Mile Ilić – 7′ 1″, Dusan Ognjenovic – 7’1″, Dragan Tubak – 7′ 2″, Nenad Misanovic – 7′ 2″, Dusan Cantekin (Dusan Gavrilovic) – 7′ 3.4″- 7′ 4″, Boban Marjanovic – 7′ 4″, Samuel Deguara – 7′ 4″, Marko Dujkovic – 7′ 5″, Marko Marcetic – 7′ 5″, Slavko Vranes – 7′ 6.5″

Note: There are Serbian Basketball teams where the average height of the men is 6′ 10″

18. Croatia basketball players over 7 feet tall:  Miro Bilan – 7′ 0″, Mario Kasun – 7′ 0″, Jusuf Nurkic – 7′ 0″, Denis Vrsaljko – 7′ 0″, Domagoj Bubalo – 7′ 0″, Filip Kraljevic – 7’0″,     Ognjen Kuzmić – 7′ 1″, Robert Rikic – 7′ 2″, Nedžad Sinanović – 7′ 3″

15. Bosnia basketball players over 7 feet tall: Nemanja Sladoje – 7′ 0″, Nedžad Sinanovic – 7′ 3″, Dalibor micic – 7′ 4.5″

13. Montenegro basketball players over 7 feet tall: Milos Lopicic – 7′ 1″

14. Slovakia basketball players over 7 feet tall:– Martin Miklosik – 7′ 5.4″

If you look at the list, you would realize that the number of extraordinrarily tall players is incredible. I don’t know which ethnic group at this point has the highest average level height. As of right now, at this point, it is not possible to determine which Ethnic Group really has the highest average height. Even though Serbia has far more 7 footers listed in its basketball program, it could be that the Serbian basketball program is just more developed than the other Nations in the Dinaric Alps area. However, what is clearly noticeable is that there is a disproportionately high number of extremely tall people in that country.

For the populations of the countries we are viewing they are from Wikipedia,

1. Serbia – 7.1 Million from October 2011

2. Croatia – 4.3 Million from March 2011

3. Bosnia & Herzegovina – 3.8 Million from June 2011

4. Montenegro – 0.6 Million from 2011

Note: This article will be edited further later, say in 1 month because I don’t know how to finish the article and reach a conclusive answer

I remembered while working on this site that there was a very unique site named wiseGEEK that I had found years ago that was in a similar format to Yahoo Ask. The reference link to wiseGEEK is found HERE. Someone asks a question and there is a standard answer and the readers can also leave their comments and answers to the question posed.

The question was “Which country has the tallest people?” I think the question was posed maybe 5 years ago (I am not sure about the real time frame, this is just a guess). However, the question has generated up to last count 310 comments.

The standard answer to the question is that the tallest nation is The Netherlands. The average male in the Netherlands was measured at 1.85 meters or slightly less than 6′ 1″ in US units. In 2nd place is Denmark , with the average male Dane being 1.83 m or 6′ 0″ tall. This claim apparently is verified quite strongly by other reports from back in 2007/2008 (Reference Link 1, Reference Link 2, Reference Link 3)

However , the answer is quick to note that “” There are taller people belonging to certain populations within countries. This is especially true of the Maasai people, who live in parts of Tanzania and Kenya. But as a whole, the citizens living in the Netherlands are on average, the tallest people. “” On a side note, the tallest member of the most recent USA swim team Matt Grevers at 6′ 8″ is Dutch.

After officially answering the question, the writer goes a little deeper in trying to figure out why the Dutch are the tallest in the world. They claim that “” the Dutch emphasis on early childhood care, a diet rich in dairy products and thus high in protein, and a fairly even distribution of wealth have contributed to making the Dutch the world’s tallest people. “”

It is also noted that the Netherlands provide for its residents some of the best Healthcare for newborns and children. The most critical stages and phases for grow are in those stage. Smart Dutch.

So basically get your calcium and vitamin D through eating a lot of dairy and getting a lot of protein. The relatively even distribution of wealth I guess means that the people don’t feel too much pressure and stress to compete and struggle to survive, thus the effect of stress reducing height is removed. OK, I am willing to go with that rather “hand waving” science reasoning.

A nice little last point made by the writer is “” Further, the measurement is “average height” which means some people far exceed 6 feet 1 inch. Some people are significantly taller and may stand nearly 7 feet (2.13 m) tall,””. Well DUH, since when any statistician creates bar graph noting all the heights of a large number of people, the distribution will become more and more bell shaped and the line will become smoother as the number of people measured becomes bigger. If that bell curved is than checked at the upper end, we are bound to find a few 7 footers. It’s not like we are measuring from a group of only 1000 people. Of course even from a 1000 people, with a country like the Netherlands we should probably not rule out that a 7 footer would be in there. I personally have not been to the Netherlands but I have heard people claim that the real local natives there (not the recent immigrants say from the middle east or northern africa) are very tall.

What is just as strange was that maybe only 1 year after the first reports came out that the Dutch were the tallest in the world, there was a few reports that showed that the Dutch do seemed to have plateaued in their height too. (Reference Link 1, Reference Link 2). Some researchers have shown that the height increase slowing down could be explained because of the influx of immigrants from shorter countries like the Middle East or South Asia. However, it is noted also that even the immigrants who arrive come to The Netherlands are on average taller than their counterparts back in their native nations.

In the last two posts I made, the focus was on the method of using cosmetic surgery to gain the height increase H.I.S. are looking for. From watching the videos, I understand the desire and intent of the men who decided to go through the surgery. It made me wonder whether they might have been suffering from some form of psychiatric disorder that kept them extremely dissatisfied with their height.

After a while, I realized that the problem is not whether they are suffering from such a condition or not (because they are suffering and dissatisfied), but more on how the psychiatric conditioned will be evaluated to be termed.

In this article HERE written by the “In These Times” blog by Lindsay Beyerstein, she argues that  Dr. Dror Paley’s term to describe his patient’s mental anguish “Height Dysphoria” may be wrongly named. I take this section from her writings.

Dr. Dror Paley, a Florida surgeon who performs cosmetic leg lengthening, claims his patients are suffering from “height dysphoria,” which he characterizes as a psychiatric disorder that can lead to suicide, but which can be cured by surgery.

Clearly, the doctor is eager to reframe this extreme procedure as therapeutic, rather than cosmetic. He’s not breaking people’s legs for vanity’s sake, he assures us, he’s curing a dangerous psychiatric disorder. Ethically, the maximum allowable risk for a cosmetic procedure is much lower than for a procedure that’s treating a potentially life-threatening disease.

The interviewer asks if people who are on the brink of suicide might be better served by counselling rather than surgery. The doctor replies, self-servingly, that counselling just doesn’t work for these people. Their only hope is to go under the knife.

It turns out, “height dysphoria,” (aka “short stature dysphoria”) isn’t a psychiatric term at all. It’s just a pseudo-technical way to say that someone is unhappy with their height. Dissatisfaction with one’s appearance is not an illness. Supposedly, “short stature dysphoria” applies to people who are consistently unhappy about their height, but happy and well-adjusted in other areas of their lives. If someone is on the brink of suicide because of their height, it’s pretty hard to argue that they are otherwise healthy and well-adjusted. The cosmetic leg lengthening industry wants to have it both ways.

The doctor may have painted himself into an ethical corner with his claim to be treating a psychiatric illness. Unlike “height dysphoria,” body dysmorphic disorder is a recognized psychiatric condition in which a person is overwhelmingly preoccupied with some aspect of their appearance. An estimated 1%-2% of the population suffers from BDD, and BDD sufferers account for 6%-15% of all patients seeking cosmetic surgery.

BDD sufferers may be fixated on their height, their nose, their skin, or other features. “Height dysphoria” sounds suspiciously like BDD focused on height. The thing is, cosmetic surgery does not ease BDD symptoms. In fact, many experts argue that BDD should be a contraindication for cosmetic surgery because it doesn’t help and may even make BDD symptoms worse.

Paley’s website claims that he does not operate on patients with BDD. But he tells 20/20 that he’s curing a psychiatric disorder with surgery. 20/20 should have challenged him to explain how “height dysphoria” differs from BDD. If his patients are as distraught as he says they are, I have a hard time believing that he’s screening out BDD cases.

Note: I tended to agree (and disagree) with the writer on her point that Dr. Paley is being kind of innacurate (whether in intentionally or unintentionally) in labeling his clients real mental condition. He does have something to be gained in having more clients and getting a bigger practice but that does not take away from the fact that his intentions can still be good and that through his work, he makes people far happier with their height and their lives after going through with his surgery. It appears that the main differences between how Dr. Paley defines say dissastifaction with short stature and how many therapists/ psychiatrist define dissatifaction with short stature comes down to whether the dissatisfaction translated beyond just height but into the overall quality of ones life. 

Beyerstein points out that Paley’s term is not medically recognized but is just another say that a person is dissatisfied with their height. She states that “”Dissatisfaction with one’s appearance is not an illness. Supposedly, “short stature dysphoria” applies to people who are consistently unhappy about their height, but happy and well-adjustedin other areas of their lives.””

“”Unlike “height dysphoria,” body dysmorphic disorder is a recognized psychiatric condition in which a person is overwhelmingly preoccupied with some aspect of their appearance. An estimated 1%-2% of the population suffers from BDD”” – I would also like to point out to Beyerstein however that new psychiatric terms are being coined and added every year. It seems like every few months, a new type fo autism is discovered and given a name. From what I’ve known, the number of terms with each new edition of the DSM only gets bigger and bigger. I am sure given enough time, Paley’s term could be medically recognized, sort of like how Fibromyalgia is like an umbrella term for most of the small chronic pain that occurs in a person’s body where the symptoms could actually be reclassified and renamed for some other disorder.

I can make the point for myself that during my phase off intense obsession with the issue year ago, I was very focused on that area of my life but I never felt that my life quality decreased from it. I was not preoccupied with it because I was also focused on improving my health and my mind. I had many other activities I was doing. It was just something that I wanted to do and accomplish extremely badly but I never got depressed from it. I

So my final question to you then is “Do You suffer from Body Dysmorphic Disorder or Height Dysmorphia?” – Or are they pretty much the same thing??

I encountered through the Make Me Taller discussion board about this ABC Special done that mainly talked about the increased use of cosmetic surgery among men in the US however focused mainly on the part where they talked about how some men are deliberately asking doctors to break their legs to add the inches. The ABC 20/20 Special Aired originally sometime during February of this year (2012).

The article written is about a guy named Apotheosis (aged 37) from the Make Me Taller boards who went from 5′ 6″ to 6′ 0″ (OR maybe 6′ 2″!). An amazing 6 (or 8) inch increase.

However, in the video there are two men who are interviewed about their experiences with the limb lengthening surgery. My previous post was about the first guy, Akash who added 2 and a half inches to his final height to almost 5′ 2″. The other guy in the video I am not sure whether he is Apotheosis or not because what he has stated and what ABC claims are 2 inches off. Dr. Dror Paley is mentioned for his practices and his quick choice to implement the newest technologies in the science of limb lengthening, which I personally have a lot of respect for.

In the video, the guy stated that he had the initial surgery that went from 5′ 6″ to 5′ 9″, a 3 inch increase. Then the video reveals that the guy in the video went back in for a 2nd surgery for more height, and was going to be around 6′ 2″ by the end. That is an 8 inch increase, not a 6 inch increase!

So Either ABC reported it wrong, the guy was lying about how much more height he as going to add, or there was something lost in the communication, assuming the guy in the video is Apotheosis.

I tried recording the video and uploading the file but the file was too big for the server to take so you will have to go to the ABC website to view it. The beginning of the video mainly talks about altering the face but the part where they talk about altering height begins around the 3:04 mark up to the end at 6:46. You can find the ABC 20/20 Special Video by clicking HERE.

I originally found the discussion about the issue from this thread HERE on MakeMeTaller.org

I have been scouring through the old forums on the other sites and decided that I should repost some very unique articles and post in a more organized, available format. Some of the links may be old or dead.

What these posts will offer is a way to see that even though there might not be a natural way to grow taller, if one has the strong enough will and desire they still can using none natural ways. I have always had the attitude that one should have all of the options available. If one has what I would call an obsessive passion, then one is willing to do anything, even illegal and immoral, to be able to get what one wants. The individual drive and desire to get what one truly goes crazy over is strong enough to do near anything.

However, What one will notice as one gets older is that the dreams and desires of one’s younger self disappeared to be replaced with less intensive desires. The rough edges are smoothed over the fire that might have once burned greatly inside oneself is replaced with general acceptance. So if you decide to wait too long in life to get this area of your life changed, you probably won’t if enough time passes. Life moves fast and you are expected by everyone to move on and push forward.

In this short video I found, a young man named Akash Shukla goes under the knife to do Limb Lengthening Surgery at the Institute For Limb Lengthening And Complex Reconstruction at Weill Cornell Medical College located at New York City. If you wanted to learn more about him, his surgery, his story, and maybe also help him by buying his book , go to his website by clicking HERE.

Note: I do not know Akash personally in any way or have ever contacted him. I just happened to find his video on youtube while doing limb lengthening research and was moved at his story. I do not get any money or incentives for endorsing or promoting his book or any other material. Again, this is out of my heart. 

Note: Only choose to read this article if you have any desire to become smarter. This article will not have any information on how you can become taller.

So I wanted to first come out and say that I am sick, very sick. I have noticed that my glands on the side of my neck was swollen and even in pain for the last 4 days and I knew before even the sickness hit that my immune system was down for a long time.  My symptoms include runny nose, dry coughing, dizziness, strange aches in parts of my body, every other classical symptom of illness there is.

So I will only write 1 blog post today.

I also plan to go take a break for tomorrow because usually this type of illness I have (pneumonia) lasts quite a few days. I know I am not invincible and I have to protect this body of mine from shutting down. I feel that I still have so much more to give to this world before this body collapses.

So what is the topic for today??

Well to do something rather completely different than just talking about height, I wanted to talk about intelligence today. My mother once told that a man is measured in only two primary ways

1. How tall he is

2. How intelligent he is

I think her message has really stuck within me for my entire life. All of my younger life all I ever wanted to be was smarter and more intelligent all of my friends and classmates. When that didn’t work out so well and I had to go to a state school to get my engineering degree, I kind of gave up on that idea. So I decided to switch and see if I could be the tallest among my peers and friends. I know, I only judge myself in two 2 ways, by my intelligence and my height. It does feel like my entire sense of confidence, self, and identity is directly connected to these two qualities.

When I was back in school, I also did an INSANE amount of research on how to become smarter, not just hot to become taller. So far, I have found a few tricks and hack one can do to increase one’s brain to operate at its optimum state.

So this article is basically for all of you out there who is interested also in making yourselves smarter. And you know what? There is apparently a “magic bullet” for this. In one of my most recent posts, I have stated that there is no magic bullet to make you taller. And that is apparently true, at least for quite a while.

However, to become smarter there is a magic bullet, at least as good it gets. I am talking about cognitive enhancement pills. The two pills I want to focus on is Provigil and Piracetam.

1. Provigil

Provigil is the advertised name of modafinil which is FDA approved. It is mainly prescribed for the conditions of narcolepsy, sleep disorders, ADHD, and sleep apnea however the biohackers out there have figured out that the supplement is a very good cognitive enhancement. The effects of the drug is that it makes your brain remove the fog and your thinking becomes far clearer. It is supposed to be able to increase your IQ by 15 points (almost an entire standard deviation) Apparently the side effects have not been found or noticed yet. It seems to be perfectly safe.

To obtain Provigil, you have to get a prescription from your doctor claiming (I don’t endorse the idea that you should lie to your doctor just to become smarter) that you suffer from Sleep Problems. Then you go to your local pharmacy. For more information about how to obtain Provigil, click HERE.

This is the wikipedia article about modafinil/provigil HERE. 

1. Piracetam

Piracetam is another “smart drug” which will help you think clearer and better. It works similar to Provigil.  If you ever saw the movie “Limitless” here the main character becomes like 100 times smarter after taking this fictional drug NZT. Well, Piracetam and Provigil is basically the real life version of NZT, only without the extreme exaggeration that Hollywood movies place on it. 

Apparently Piracetam is obtainable without a prescription. You can even go to Amazon and order it. The link available is HERE. So you pay $20 for a bottle of 60 tablets of 800 mg of piracetam. Or you can go to drugstore.com I don’t do affiliate marketing (yet) so I am not getting paid for endorsing these products.

This is the wikipedia article about piracetam HERE

On a related note, I recently contacted Dave Asprey of Bulletproof Executive through his twitter account and asked whether I could interview him and he said yes. I saw him on an ABC special on the use of “smart pills” . For his CNN interview about his Provigil Usage click HERE. For his ABC appearance , click HERE.

Apparently Dave has no idea who the hell I am (yet) and doesn’t know what the projects I am working on are. Apparently his hobbies and projects are very similar to mine. His Bulletproof Executive blog/website is to help the reader learn how to hack his body and mind to reach it’s optimum performance. It is sort of like Tim Ferris’s Book the 4 Hour Body (which I bought and read)

If you go to Asprey’s website and watch his video, you would see that he has done some of the same stuff that I intend to do. His experiences with Ayahuasca is on my bucket list. I first found out about Ayahuasca (and Chacruna) about 3 years ago from a seminar. He has done meditation with monks in Tibet which I have wanted to do.

If I ever do manage to interview him, I would like to record the interview in mp3 format and post it on this blog here. It is really worth listening to. I mean, our body is more than just our height. I want to hack my body in more ways than just making it be taller.